Great talk! I like your "ask"-- we need to make factory farming a mainstream topic in the media, politics, and general social discourse before we can make any real progress.
As a former vegetarian (10 years on, 25 years off), I still harbor some guilt or uncomfortable feelings when eating meat or using leather. I have several food allergies and intolerances which would make veganism challenging if not possible from a nutrition standpoint. But after listening to your interview on the Win-Win podcast (which I highly recommend to anyone reading this), my cognitive dissonance is at a breaking point. I don't think eating meat is immoral (if anything, maybe, amoral) but factory farming certainly is. I think people just want what they want: the taste and texture of meat, nostalgia associated with certain foods and holidays, being social around meals/going to favorite restaurants. People don't want to deprive themselves, perhaps feeling like there are already so many things they want, or think they want, that are out of reach; plus, people really, really hate being uncomfortable.
I'm not sure what my point is, but I appreciate the work that you do. I'm making the effort to buy certified humane but also reduce my consumption of meat (I don't eat dairy or eggs). I have this fantasy that by eating less meat my food allergies will go away, thereby allowing me to incorporate more vegetable protein in my diet.
Very well done — appreciate having “something” to send to family who just don’t want to believe.
As a Catholic convert of only a few years, I am surprised and saddened that we are not leading the way on this. Charles Camosy book For Love of Animals is written from that perspective (tho very appropriate for all Christians) and I have taken to handing it out; unfortunately, it is hard to find now.
Here is my ASK - will you specifically address dairy? The extreme cruelty to the babies (and mamas of course) should be shouted far and wide. And the whole USA subsidy situation (demand is irrelevant due to margin funding) is criminal. Please take a few hours to look into this.
Wow good progress thank you Lewis Bollard. I was recently shocked by posting a veg (not even vegan) meme for our Help Animals India page and although many compassionate and supportive comments the level of "trolls" was shocking to see . Here is what someone posted in support of us finally this made me feel a little better if interested please read: PREPARE FOR TROLLS! DO NOT ENGAGE! LEARN THEIR PSYCHOLOGY ⬇️
Trolling vegan forums with pro-meat comments is often a defensive reaction, allowing non-vegans to deflect guilt and assert their identity. The mockery may also be fueled by social validation and broader cultural conflicts.
Psychological defensiveness
The meat paradox: Many people experience "cognitive dissonance" because their compassion for animals clashes with their enjoyment of eating meat. Trolling vegans is a way to relieve this internal conflict by belittling the person whose lifestyle forces a confrontation with their own choices.
Defensive omnivorism: When meat-eaters are confronted with arguments about animal suffering, some studies show they respond by derogating vegetarians and making jokes at their expense. The mocking comments aren't necessarily based on humor but are a strategic defense mechanism to make the vegan's message less impactful.
Masking personal insecurity: For some, trolling is an unconscious defense mechanism to point out a vegan's imperfections, making themselves feel less guilty about their own choices. If the vegan is flawed, it's easier to dismiss their lifestyle and avoid trying it.
Social and cultural factors
Stereotypes and misunderstandings: Trolls often operate under the inaccurate belief that all vegans are "militant," "judgmental," or "extreme". Trolling can be a way to reinforce these negative stereotypes, creating an adversarial image of vegans that is easier to ridicule.
Group mentality and validation: Online platforms allow like-minded individuals to congregate and reinforce their beliefs in echo chambers. In these groups, mocking vegans can become a cooperative assertion of a group's collective identity, providing social validation at the expense of those who are different.
Cultural identity: In some cultures, meat has long symbolized tradition, strength, and masculinity. A choice to avoid meat can be perceived as an attack on these values, leading to a defensive pushback. It's often easier to make a joke than to confront potentially shaky notions of identity.
Retaliation against "internet vegans": Some trolling is a reaction to the aggressive or judgmental behavior of a vocal minority of vegans online. Some people who were previously "trolled" or shamed by vegans for their eating habits may return the favor, contributing to a cycle of negativity.
Personality traits
In some cases, trolling is driven by antisocial personality traits rather than specific anti-vegan beliefs. Research has found that trolling, in general, is associated with the "dark tetrad" personality traits, particularly sadism—the enjoyment of being cruel to others.
Thanks for sharing this! I'm always very interested in your thoughts on messaging, and this was no exception. Particularly what you viewed as the key decision points. Thanks for all of the excellent, thoughtful work you do on this important issue!
And BTW, first-time commenter, but big fan of yours since your 2017 80k interview!
I've shared a bunch of your stuff with various friends throughout the years, with some success, but have typically used other resources for the most marginal cases, i.e. where interest/motivation/etc. are lower and I need something short and introductory. Your TED talk has changed that - I've already had one good use for it (sharing it after a book club where our treatment of animals came up) and I expect to have many more opportunities in the future. Thanks again for the great work!
Great talk! I like your "ask"-- we need to make factory farming a mainstream topic in the media, politics, and general social discourse before we can make any real progress.
Great to read about your thoughts preceding this great talk. And yes, starting to speak up is perhaps the most powerful thing we can do.
Great to see you got a standing ovation!
Such an honour to work with you Lewis!
Thanks so very much, Lewis. Closing in on 40 years in this area; I am filled with appreciation of your thoughtful dedication.
As a former vegetarian (10 years on, 25 years off), I still harbor some guilt or uncomfortable feelings when eating meat or using leather. I have several food allergies and intolerances which would make veganism challenging if not possible from a nutrition standpoint. But after listening to your interview on the Win-Win podcast (which I highly recommend to anyone reading this), my cognitive dissonance is at a breaking point. I don't think eating meat is immoral (if anything, maybe, amoral) but factory farming certainly is. I think people just want what they want: the taste and texture of meat, nostalgia associated with certain foods and holidays, being social around meals/going to favorite restaurants. People don't want to deprive themselves, perhaps feeling like there are already so many things they want, or think they want, that are out of reach; plus, people really, really hate being uncomfortable.
I'm not sure what my point is, but I appreciate the work that you do. I'm making the effort to buy certified humane but also reduce my consumption of meat (I don't eat dairy or eggs). I have this fantasy that by eating less meat my food allergies will go away, thereby allowing me to incorporate more vegetable protein in my diet.
Very well done — appreciate having “something” to send to family who just don’t want to believe.
As a Catholic convert of only a few years, I am surprised and saddened that we are not leading the way on this. Charles Camosy book For Love of Animals is written from that perspective (tho very appropriate for all Christians) and I have taken to handing it out; unfortunately, it is hard to find now.
Here is my ASK - will you specifically address dairy? The extreme cruelty to the babies (and mamas of course) should be shouted far and wide. And the whole USA subsidy situation (demand is irrelevant due to margin funding) is criminal. Please take a few hours to look into this.
Peace, blessing and love to you and yours.
Wow good progress thank you Lewis Bollard. I was recently shocked by posting a veg (not even vegan) meme for our Help Animals India page and although many compassionate and supportive comments the level of "trolls" was shocking to see . Here is what someone posted in support of us finally this made me feel a little better if interested please read: PREPARE FOR TROLLS! DO NOT ENGAGE! LEARN THEIR PSYCHOLOGY ⬇️
Trolling vegan forums with pro-meat comments is often a defensive reaction, allowing non-vegans to deflect guilt and assert their identity. The mockery may also be fueled by social validation and broader cultural conflicts.
Psychological defensiveness
The meat paradox: Many people experience "cognitive dissonance" because their compassion for animals clashes with their enjoyment of eating meat. Trolling vegans is a way to relieve this internal conflict by belittling the person whose lifestyle forces a confrontation with their own choices.
Defensive omnivorism: When meat-eaters are confronted with arguments about animal suffering, some studies show they respond by derogating vegetarians and making jokes at their expense. The mocking comments aren't necessarily based on humor but are a strategic defense mechanism to make the vegan's message less impactful.
Masking personal insecurity: For some, trolling is an unconscious defense mechanism to point out a vegan's imperfections, making themselves feel less guilty about their own choices. If the vegan is flawed, it's easier to dismiss their lifestyle and avoid trying it.
Social and cultural factors
Stereotypes and misunderstandings: Trolls often operate under the inaccurate belief that all vegans are "militant," "judgmental," or "extreme". Trolling can be a way to reinforce these negative stereotypes, creating an adversarial image of vegans that is easier to ridicule.
Group mentality and validation: Online platforms allow like-minded individuals to congregate and reinforce their beliefs in echo chambers. In these groups, mocking vegans can become a cooperative assertion of a group's collective identity, providing social validation at the expense of those who are different.
Cultural identity: In some cultures, meat has long symbolized tradition, strength, and masculinity. A choice to avoid meat can be perceived as an attack on these values, leading to a defensive pushback. It's often easier to make a joke than to confront potentially shaky notions of identity.
Retaliation against "internet vegans": Some trolling is a reaction to the aggressive or judgmental behavior of a vocal minority of vegans online. Some people who were previously "trolled" or shamed by vegans for their eating habits may return the favor, contributing to a cycle of negativity.
Personality traits
In some cases, trolling is driven by antisocial personality traits rather than specific anti-vegan beliefs. Research has found that trolling, in general, is associated with the "dark tetrad" personality traits, particularly sadism—the enjoyment of being cruel to others.
Fantastic talk! I think you made the right call on the Ask.
I'm amazed that TED hasn't platformed the problem of factory farming, glad to see you pioneering on that stage.
Also good to ignore ChatGPT's cheesy, oh i mean cheezy, ideas.
Brilliant. Thank you for explaining your way to it!
Thanks for sharing this! I'm always very interested in your thoughts on messaging, and this was no exception. Particularly what you viewed as the key decision points. Thanks for all of the excellent, thoughtful work you do on this important issue!
And BTW, first-time commenter, but big fan of yours since your 2017 80k interview!
I've shared a bunch of your stuff with various friends throughout the years, with some success, but have typically used other resources for the most marginal cases, i.e. where interest/motivation/etc. are lower and I need something short and introductory. Your TED talk has changed that - I've already had one good use for it (sharing it after a book club where our treatment of animals came up) and I expect to have many more opportunities in the future. Thanks again for the great work!
Great talk, Lewis. Hoping the video makes it to YouTube soon as well!
Must watch. Must share. Thank you, Lewis!
Thank you! No one is talking about it anymore!